finding a birth town

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 10:18 am Post subject: finding a birth town

Hello all! I have signed on with your site due to Carole Razz

I "know " her from another forum. My dilemma: I was told years ago by my Great Auntie that she thought my great-grandfather was from Porto Ceresio although I have yet to find documentation to prove this. Now my uncle has sent me some information indicating this may not be correct. I have scoured LDS files, am unable to locate church records; marriage and death records simply state Italy as place of birth. I have submitted a query to Porto Ceresio, but have not yet received a reply.
Great-grand's name was Carlo Gasper Carabelli married to Carlotta (Charlotte) Rampanelli in Cleveland Ohio 1899. Charles (Carlo) was born July 1874 according to census and arrived Castle Gardens 1890. He died 1913 so there is no SSN for him.

I have also been unable to find any first papers, declarations, etc. I think he never applied. Alien registration research has also come up blank.

Any help on this one? Thanks to all! You have a great site here!

nuccia · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Hi Cherylc

Carole and I were looking into this a bit and we did find a Carlo in Ohio who was married to an Adele Pozzi born roughly about the same time as your Carlo and immigrated about the same time - which is a bit different from you wrote above. Can you provide us with the spelling or the image of the Census record(s) in which you are referring to? Also, if you could let us know the names of any children they had it would help.

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 1:27 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Did the info and the census attachment not go through?

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

I'm trying to attach the census again....

This 1900 census is from Vermont. GGF was a migrant granite worker so after the spring thaw, they would go to VT from Cleveland/Detroit. The 1910 census shows them in Detroit but I only have a hardcopy and no scanner. They both lived and married in Cleveland, but I don't know when they made the move to Detroit.

Their children include:
(the baby John on the census died that year on the way back to Cleveland)
John Alcide -- my grandfather
Mannie -- he changed his name from what he was given
Eva -- still living but not communicating
and I think there was 1 more, but cannot remember right now and of course the 1910 census is in the car which is not here at the moment.

The Carlo you found I believe was GGG-Uncle Joe's son.

Carlo (Charles) father was John Carabelli; mother was Giovanna Arioli.
Carlotta (Charlotte) father was Joseph Rampanelli -- a cigar manufacturer in Cleveland; mother was Vittoria Pellini.

And that's about all I have right now.

OOOOOOOOPS!! I keep getting a message saying "the extension doc is not allowed" so am sending this without the census attached. Please let me know how to fix this.

Robert · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Hi,

Don't know if this helps at all but did a search on localities for the two surnames. There are few overlaps and this might be a clue as to where the family is from in Italy. Even after they settled in America it is likely that your great-grandfather married someone who was originally from the same village/town in Italy as his own family.

Carabelli:

www.gens.labo.net/it/c...enera.html

Rampanelli

www.gens.labo.net/it/c...enera.html

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 2:42 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Thanks, Robert! I have already searched that site, but it is nice to be reminded of its' existence. I looked at it again on your suggestion. It is interesting to see where the concentrations are. It seems that most of the Carabelli family that I know are related, went to Cleveland when they first arrived -- GGG-Uncle Joe being the first though he was in NYC for 10 years or so before that. My uncle told me he had heard the Rampanelli clan was from an "Alpine town somewhere in Lombardy". I have absolutely no idea how they ended up in Cleveland. But, since both families lived in Little Italy and both were from the north, it makes sense they met and married there.

uantiti · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:22 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Hi,
I found a manifest listing a Giovanni Rampanelli reaching his father Giuseppe in Cleveland, he's a cigar manufacturer, he's on line 14 and he's travelling with his wife on line 30, she's Giuseppina (née Liborio) Rampanelli. They come from Luino (province of Varese), 14 miles from Porto Ceresio. His place of birth is Martirolo but it's mispelled as the correct name is Marchirolo and it's more or less half way between Luino and Porto Ceresio. He's probably related to the people you are trying to find. Hope it helps.

Page 1 Click to enlarge

Page 2 Click to enlarge

Ada

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:35 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Wow! I had found the manifest for GGM-Charlotte. She was 4 when she came over with her mother and siblings in 1885. Presumably, they were joining Charlotte's father, Joseph. The folks you found are probably relations and, I would think, likely be from the same town as the ones I am looking for. I'll research this town! Thanks so much!!

uantiti · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

I saw now your other post. Yes, Marchirolo is on the mountains in Lombardy region and was the town of a sculptor: Eugenio Pellini.

On this site you can see some old pictures of Marchirolo

Marchirolo

Ada

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Just checked the manifest I have and there was a 5-year old Giovanni who was GGM-Charlotte's older brother. If I am reading your manifest correctly, that Giovanni first came to the US in 1885 -- same as mine -- most likely making him the same guy! This is very exciting!! Please let me know if there is fault in my reasoning.

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

GGM-Charlotte's mother's maiden name was PELLINI!!!! This is amazing. More to research. Thank you so much!

uantiti · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 5:04 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Yes, I think he's the same Giovanni and I suppose your GGM Carlotta was born in the same place as her brother. So you can request her birth certificate.

Ada

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 5:50 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

I don't know how to thank you except to shout out: THANK YOU SO MUCH kiss

and of course with 3 BIG KISSES!!!!

Carole · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:05 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Nuccia will be back soon and she 'may' have also found other links for other family members in the Milan area....

But I'm so pleased that you found the help here that you were seeking Cheryl - and it didn't take long did it? This might help some newer members on Expats to realise that sometimes genealogists can be a great help in searches to assist citizenship documentation. And - we're free boot!

cherylc · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:41 pm Post subject: Re: finding a birth town

Carole, thank you so much! Not to worry, I will definitely pass on this helpful site to the expats folks. Now, I continue the wait on GGF-Charles' info from Porto Ceresio..... You folks are terrific!!