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Community Forums › All Things Italian › Translations › Cache of letters

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Cache of letters
For help with translating documents or writing letters.
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tjbrn
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Very interesting Cathy. The patron saint of Sicily certainly fits as both of my maternal grandparents were from Sicily. I also found this reference.

Quote::
Skulls are associated with such penitent saints as st francis of
assisi, st jerome and st mary magdalene. when included in
depictions of them the skull may have a cross placed nearby.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

OK - I remembered another female saint who is protrayed with a skull. Saint Rosalia is the Patron Saint of Sicily. Saint Rosalia is also portrayed with a garland of flowers encircling her head as you see in your image also.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

tjbrn wrote:
I also found this in the packet of photos. Any idea what it is?

It appears to me that the woman in this metal is definitely not the Virgin Mary. I have never seen her portrayed with a skull in her hand. There is only one female Saint that is portrayed holding skulls - Mary Magdalene. There are a few male saints but she is the only female one I know of. I cannot make out what is in her other hand.
The crossed flags is a common symbol for many Italian-American societies and organizations. Among many other things, she is the Patron Saint of Casamicciola, Italy.
Not sure this will help...

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Thanks, Carole for translating what Luca wrote. I did notice the "zia" and the "zio" and it aroused my curiosity.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 7:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Luca wrote:
liviomoreno wrote:

tanti baci a mia zia caro zio o gli (?) sapere se mi conosce=many kisses to my aunt ....to know if he knows me

C'è qualcosa che non mi convince: sembra che prima di zia ci sia stata una parola cancellata dal timbro o dallo scorrere del tempo. Però fila anche come l'hai tradotta tu.

"Tanti baci a mia zia. Caro zio voglio sapere se mi conosce."

Ora resta da capire a chi si riferisce "conosce": io credo sia riferito alla zia perché la "domanda" è rivolta allo zio, tipo: caro zio voglio sapere se la zia si ricorda di me, o anche: voglio sapere se sa di me, chi sono io-
Ma è poco importante; il resto della lettera da te tradotta è sicuramente più interessante.
(Scrivo in italiano tanto so che Tom mi capisce Wink )

Luca


Translation:
There's something that doesn't convince me: it seems that before the zia another word has been cancelled by the stamp or the passing of time. But it follows as you have translated it.

Many kisses to my aunt. Dear uncle I would like to know if you recognise me.


Now it remains to understand to who he refers "knows/recognises": I believe that it refers to the aunt because the question is aimed at the uncle, like: dear uncle I want to know if my aunt remembers me, or maybe: I would like to know if she knows of me, who I am-
But it's of little importance; th remainder of the letter translated by you is certainly more interesting.
(I'm writing in Italian a lot so Tom can understand me Smile



Sorry I've not been around today. Thanks Livio and Luca... youre both wonderful! kiss

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 6:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

It was a "non-important" matter about the few words in the back of photos that i tried to solve with the help of Livio.
Don't be modest, Tom: i know that you understand italian very well Wink

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 6:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Yes, Luca, I know that you are writing in Italian so that I can understand you Mr. Green But not so much! I'm still only crawling as far as comprehension goes.

Carole, there is nothing on the back. On the front appears to be an image of the Virgin Mary. There appear to be two other figures but I'll have to get out a magnifying glass to see if I can make out more.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 6:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

liviomoreno wrote:

tanti baci a mia zia caro zio o gli (?) sapere se mi conosce=many kisses to my aunt ....to know if he knows me

C'è qualcosa che non mi convince: sembra che prima di zia ci sia stata una parola cancellata dal timbro o dallo scorrere del tempo. Però fila anche come l'hai tradotta tu.

Tanti baci a mia zia. Caro zio voglio sapere se mi conosce.

Ora resta da capire a chi si riferisce "conosce": io credo sia riferito alla zia perché la "domanda" è rivolta allo zio, tipo: caro zio voglio sapere se la zia si ricorda di me, o anche: voglio sapere se sa di me, chi sono io-
Ma è poco importante; il resto della lettera da te tradotta è sicuramente più interessante.
(Scrivo in italiano tanto so che Tom mi capisce Wink )

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

tjbrn wrote:
I also found this in the packet of photos. Any idea what it is?


Well I checked down all of these but couldn't see it.
>Medals List<

It looks like a joint American-Italian medal with the two flags prominent on the ribbon, but hard to make out what the device is on the front. Just a man (soldier?) kneeling before what 'may' be the Virgin Mary holding a child. Is it bronze Tom? Does it have/say anything on the back?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 12:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Thanks, Livio. Actually the town is Salem, NJ in the heading of the letter, which is where I was born. This letter seems to confirm what I suspected: my grandfather could not write and probably was not able to read either. The reference about walking 2 kilometers to get the letter written suggests that he dictated the letter to someone else. One of my uncles by marriage was also Sicilian and spoke Italian with my grandfather lived on the same street as my grandparents (all but one of his children did, with most of the families living next to one another, in fact we lived directly across the street from my grandparent's house) so I'm curious about who wrote the letter for my grandfather. There was also a grocery store on the same street which was owned by an Italian family some of whose members were god parents to my aunts and uncles. The misspelling of the surname may or may not indicate that someone other than my grandfather wrote this letter.

It's difficult to get a sense of time from this letter. The dead son to whom he refers died in 1945. I wish more names had been mentioned!

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 12:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Page 1:

Salemini (?), Jan 18 1955
Dear sister, after a long time I received your beloved letter and I was comforted that you are in good health all together with your family and I want to assure that, thanks God, I and my family are in good health so far.

Page2:

my dear sister you want to know why I did not write to you, you know that I am not able to write and there is nobody here who is able to write in Italian. I had to walk 2 kilometers to write this letter, therefore you should not get angry if I don't write. My dear sister, you want to know why I did not tell you of

Page3:

the death of my son. He was a soldier when this happened and at that time I did not think about it [= about telling you]. I had 7 children, 4 males and 3 females, now I have 6. Five of them are married and one lives with me and is 16 years old. Dear sister you want to know if your brother in law is dead or alive, I don't know. When I go to Philadelphia I will ask and let you know


Page4:

I have nothing else to say. I send you many greetings and also my children greet you and kiss you one after the other. I and my wife greet you one after the other and we give you many kisses from the heart and I am your dear brother who loves you a lot. Ignazio Dagotto

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:58 am    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote


Il sposo da tua sorella Concettina di saluto e di bacio=The spouse of your sister Concettina, gretings and kisses


tanti baci a mia zia caro zio o gli (?) sapere se mi conosce=many kisses to my aunt ....to know if he knows me

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:43 am    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

I also found this in the packet of photos. Any idea what it is?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:41 am    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

Notes on back of photos.




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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:34 am    Post subject: Re: Cache of letters Reply with quote

I've been waiting for a relative to send me some photos that were loaned to him by my cousin. A package came today with some photos but I also found this letter, which appears to have been written by my grandfather, Ignazio. The letter is written in Italian and is written in 1955. It's written to one of his sister's but I'm not certain it was ever mailed and I have no idea how it came to be included in this packet of photos. While I've learned to translate some Italian, I must defer to the translators on Gente to get a clear understanding of what has been written.

Page 1:


Page2:


Page3:


Page4:


I also have some note on the back of photos which I will post separately.

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