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New Type of Record
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BillieDeKid
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 5:46 pm    Post subject: New Type of Record Reply with quote

I've been working on my comune's records and came across a document I've never seen before. Nuccia thought it would be a good idea to post it so everyone can take a look. Might help someone if they're looking at microfilms.

I asked Riccardo what this was and he explained that it's a document stating that neither person in the marriage owns anything. Many years ago our ancestors marriages were arranged by the parents so the marriage was a contract and the parties involved would have this done.

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MauroMags
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 6:42 pm    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Am i the only one that finds this amusing! A certificate of "having nothing!"
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Cathy
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 8:28 pm    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Interesting document - thanks for posting it. I have never seen one like it before. Mauro, thats very funny - I did not think of it that way before! Very Happy

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nuccia
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 9:01 pm    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Mauro..

I shall take 2 please...

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 1:34 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Nuccia,

I should change my name to "Mauro Nullatenenza!"
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nuccia
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 4:56 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Whoo hoo..now you're talking! I wonder why someone would get a record like this done. What purpose would it serve? Does anyone know?

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liviomoreno
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:32 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

nuccia wrote:
Whoo hoo..now you're talking! I wonder why someone would get a record like this done. What purpose would it serve? Does anyone know?
If you are "Nullatenente" you may avoid to give money to your spouse in case of divorce, you may avoid to pay debts, and I evevn believe that you are entitled for a special pension!!!!! I'm not 100% sure...

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Luca
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:34 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Billie already said it:

Quote::
I asked Riccardo what this was and he explained that it's a document stating that neither person in the marriage owns anything. Many years ago our ancestors marriages were arranged by the parents so the marriage was a contract and the parties involved would have this done. [Note by me: if they owned something they had to do a "Costituzione di dote": with this document they avoided to do it]

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nuccia
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:36 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Thanks..I guess I missed that!

But what is a Costituzione di dote?

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Luca
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:38 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Livio was faster than me. Crying or Very sad
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ricbru
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:56 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Since long time ago the marriage of the couple was arranged by the parents of groom and bride, since they used to live in a not wealth situation
and the marriage was a REAL contract, the DOTE is the full items brought from the bride.
The Dote is still brought in the marriage, especcially in the south of Italy, by the bride.
In the DOTE you find several sheets for bed, several blankets, covers table, napkins, bra, underwear, and so on.
In my area, when the parents can afford, they start to buy all this stuff at least when the daughter is about 10 or 15 years old, so when it is time
for her to get married, she has the DOTE to bring with her for the new family.
I hope it helps
bye Riccardo

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HELP ME to find the ship manifest of 1902 to USA, about my GGFather Francesco Paolo BRUNO from Trapani (1860/1938)
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Carole
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 10:01 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Quote::
"What is a Costituzione di dote?"

It is the gift of an 'Endowment', but the literal translation would be the creation of a dowry (dote).

From Wickipedia Italia:
"L'uso di trasmettere alcuni beni con il matrimonio è sancito nel diritto romano con lo scopo duplice di indennizzare la donna che uscendo dalla famiglia di origine perdeva il diritto all'eredità paterna, e di contribuire alle spese del matrimonio.

Il codice giustinianeo del VI secolo che la rese obbligatoria; questo istituto, seppure modificato, sopravvisse in Italia fino al 1975, quando, con la riforma del diritto di famiglia, fu vietato.

Tradizionalmente in Italia nelle società contadine la dote era costituita da una cassapanca contenente il corredo che doveva consistere di un certo numero di lenzuola, tovaglie, piatti, bicchieri ed altre suppellettili per la casa."


My translation:
The custom of transmitting any goods with the marriage was sanctioned under roman rights with the double purpose of compensating the woman, who leaving her original family, lost her right to a paternal inheritance, and to contribute towards the marriage expenses.

The Justinian code of the VI century made it compulsory; this institution, even though modified, survived in Italy until 1975, when, with the amendment of the rights of the family, it was prohibited.

Traditionally in Italy in the peasant society the dowry was made up of a chest containing the trousseau that would constitute a certain number of sheets, table cloths, plates, glasses and other household furnishings.

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ricbru
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Thank you very much Carole, as always you are the best
bye Riccardo

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HELP ME to find the ship manifest of 1902 to USA, about my GGFather Francesco Paolo BRUNO from Trapani (1860/1938)
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BillieDeKid
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:57 pm    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

Thanks for having me post the document Nuccia. I've learned alot!!

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nuccia
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 4:11 pm    Post subject: Re: New Type of Record Reply with quote

You're welcome, Billie, but thank everyone else! We all learned a lot!

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